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LLOY - Share buyback 2019

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#342

Absolutely correct Bowman. It would be far better in my opinion if any shares to be issued as bonuses were to be bought on the stock exchange.

Frog


#343

I would tend to agree, but I am not enough of an accountant to really say that overall it would be a good thing.

One has to remember that the funds required to buy the bonus shares would have to come out of profits, which is exactly where the funds being used for the buybacks are coming from, so really there would be no difference apart from timing and the actual price paid.

The question then is should the remaining funds that are actually being used to reduce the number of shares in issue be paid as a dividend instead. This is a rather philosophical discussion which depends on capital (share price) and income (dividend per share) standpoints.


#344

Again, I am no expert on these matters but as a shareholder I have no preference for either buy-backs or dividend payments. What seems to me to be likely that the occasional bit of housekeeping to trim the number of share in issue is sensible rather than just letting them grow and grow and diluting the value of individual shares. As far as shares being issued for bonuses I would like to see these trimmed back. I am far from convinced that this practice adds anything in meaningful incentives and, along with most people, I think that bankers are absolutely over-paid.

Cheers,

Frog in a tree


#345

Hi @regardless, Yes but remember whilst this might indicate that funds would be available to pay a higher dividend, any such dividend doesnt exist in reality until (and unless) it is actually declared. Sadly they might choose to do other things with their money and keep their dividend per share the same…

ATB

Pref


#346

HI @frog_in_a_tree, Well give me a £ in my pocket in the form of a dividend compared with a “might affect the share price if I’m lucky” buyback, my vote is always firmly on the former. Especially when the whole aim of the buyback is just to reduce the share dilution from the companies share schemes, which are great for employees but not so great for shareholders !!!.

Never seen or heard another word from @trader_jack in months now, I do hope he is sunning himself somewhere nice and driving around in his new car - and that nothing untoward has happened to him. Have you seen any more posts from him ?.

ATB

Pref


#347

Hi All, Well positive mood music from the Trump - Xi meeting on trade at the G20 by the sound of it. IG weekend trading showing everything up. Looking forward to a positive open on Monday !!.

Meanwhile enjoy the sunshine. Off to the pub followed by a BBQ myself…

ATB

Pref


#348

Sadly no word from Trader Jack. Always enjoyed our conversations. Maybe he has decamped to another platform?

Cheers,

Frog


#349

Question: Lloyds employees / staff who do participant in the 3 or 5 years share save schemes they pay out of their Salary monthly up to £250.00, upon maturity they get the option to keep or sale the shares on the open market and the company just issues bulk shares in May time I believe

What happens to the money that was paid by the staff for share save shares ?

Is this added to profits ?


#350

Most basic and sensible question that I found in this thread for the first time!! Isn’t the LBG staff monthly contributions who choose to take part in this benefit constitute at least some part of the buyback fund? The shares are rewarded at an option price, which then the participant could buy the shares at after 3 years (if they are prepared to pay the associated NI and IT) or get the cash instead. Or do that after 5 years with no taxation.

The Sharesave scheme was an agreement between the workers unions (Accord and Unite?) and the LBG as employer negotiated in 2015. And the bod has to abide by it! Isn’t it ?

So, probably the buyback programme is to limit the risk to LBG from devising this scheme as an Employee benefit.


#351

If he doesn’t do one of his famous ‘stab-in-the-back’ Tweets from the plane on the way home. You never know with this president. Everything he said about china was pretty much predictable, in fact was exactly predicted, but his M.O. is often to play nice at such meetings then lash out again later.

It certainly would do the global economy a great deal of good if this whole thing was settled, but the amount of harm already done is pretty massive and the longer the tariffs stay in place global trade will just adapt around them leaving the US consumer picking up the tab and China (just about everyone’s major trading partner these days) set back as an economic power by a few years.

Which is probably Trump’s real motivation here.


#352

@Regardless, take a look at the Annual Report. Note 45 to the Accounts (page 235) covers share-based payments (that include the SAYE scheme), and you can see from the Accounts where the money goes.


#353

Interestingly between the 15th May 2015 to 15th June 2015 Lloyds share price was in the 85p to 90p range take the 20% staff discount share price option to purchase these shares could be priced around 68p ?

5 years on the plans are up in 12 months ( June 2020)

Lloyds needs the price to be well above 68p in June 2020 or staff will cancel their share options and request their money back

Antiono may need to up the anti over the next 12 months IMHO

Maybe expect some big news (eye catching positive news ) early 2020 if shares Still trading below 70p :wink:


#354

Hi

Although I generally switch off weekends I did notice IG weekend markets, yes very positive, big rises.
That can turn on a dime.

I hate trading their w/e markets but have actually gone DOW short.
I am thinking along the lines of Eadwig s post, Trump all nice in personal meetings but then can change within minutes. Spread was horrible.

Share buyback, smoke and mirrors, I will say no more.

As to traderjack, not seen anything from him in ages.
Used to enjoy his and FIAT s posts re WW 1 history, despite knowing very little about it myself.

He did join another board that I also am on and I did exchange a very pleasant message with him, this more than a year ago though.

I hope he is OK, one of life s gentlemen.

I will try to get back in touch.

ATB

soi


#355

Not posted an update for a while, and am about to go off for a month’s holiday at our house in northern Thailand. So here is a short update before I go, with another to follow when I get back…

92 days into the buyback and 44.5% (£778m) of the funds have been spent buying back 1.28bn shares at an average price of 60.86p. That is an average volume of 13.9m shares per trading day.


We seem to have returned to a relatively constant spend per day, after a short period where daily volumes jumped around a bit. The average daily spend for the past 9 days has been £7.6m

I still estimate the buyback should be finished by the end of October when the total number of shares in issue should have been reduced to 69bn shares, or 3.3% less than when the buyback started.


#356

TOP MAN Bowman

Enjoy your months Holiday in Northern Thailand Sir


#357

Turn up the eating MACHINE PLEASE

CEO Antonio

Bargains all round today :slight_smile:


#358

Agreed. I added a chunk at 53p this morning.

The headline news was disappointing, so fed up with below-the-line impairments and conduct provisions, AHO pay+pension award still makes me angry. But the fundamental performance was better than expected. Especially impressed with reduced costs and further improvements to come. Despite a third year of pessimism over BREXIT and where the UK economy is (or is not) heading, business has been good. Who knows, maybe that last PPI commitment was conservative.

That all makes LLOY a solid 6% yielder at this level. Dividend very safe and slowly progressive.

Looking forward to what analysts say and whether that stimulates the sp.


#359

I am content in knowing we also buying and cancelling shares below 53p today and will be right up to October time :slight_smile:

Lovely Jubbly

PUMP UP THE JAM PUMP IT UP PUMP IT UP


#360

Lloyd’s Buy Back machine was turned on again today :slight_smile:


#361

So how are we doing with buybacks now we have gone ex-div?

Done my bit for the cause, added a further and probably final chunk at 50.1p yesterday which struck me as about a 5 year low despite reporting sustained performance and now a progressive 6% dividend throughout all the gloomy background nonsense. At a price which seemed ridiculously low when Goldman Sachs proposed it before revising upwards to 67p I think having come to their senses. Current consensus is down to 66p from 70p a year ago.

But for PPI, the extra bank levies and supertaxes and so on for the last three years I have felt LLOY was worth up to 75p on its way to 100p. It has managed to disappoint in below the line costs but its effective reduction of operating costs has been impressive, with room for more to come as we become more digital and less High Street. And I was furious about the decision to go for buy back rather than high yield. But I have stuck with it and by trading the cycles I have averaged down my holding from around 67p to 60p or so.

Not sure what I am waiting for to turn this round, a pick up in the mortgage market or consumer credit or … a sexy announcement about working with Schroders, a breakthrough deal with XYZ to capture the digital market for contactless payment, first to market with payee authentication procedures which kill off push-fraud … but while LLOY remains the pick of the bunch for boring banking we should not be down at 50p should we it is so frustrating.