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Brexit Wars 3

lse:hsba
lse:lloy
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#27416

HJ - hi

J_W has never been known to let facts get in the way of prejudice m8
Tick … Tock …
JAR
:jack_o_lantern:


#27417

The fact is Huw that it isn’t my “narrative”.

I am reminding you and others of recent Government, IMF forecasts and also from various UK Tech companies.

Everything I’ve said has links to the sources.


#27418

John, unlike the childish, pathetic comments you continually make… my posts are based on facts or material from specialists and I always post the source material.


#27419

Huw - whether the UK has higher growth than EU states, Eurozone or any other country in the world totally misses the point as you well know.

The point, in terms of Brexit, is that the UK growth is forecast to be worse outside of the EU than had we remained in the EU.
The Government and the IMF and every independent organisation are on record with those forecasts.

It doesn’t mean the UK won’t have growth… it means the growth is less than had we stayed in the EU.

As a reminder, this is what the IMF recently said which is nothing to get excited about:

The International Monetary Fund (IMF) left its forecast for UK economic growth this year and next unchanged on Monday, but warned that the outlook depended on Britain avoiding a no-deal exit from the European Union.

The financial watchdog said the UK economy would grow by 1.4 per cent this year and 1.5 per cent in 2021 after anaemic growth of 1.3 per cent last year. The figures are unchanged from its October forecasts.


#27420

The American Dream. Certainly NOT the European one.


#27421

But still lower than if we had remained in the EU. You’re so blinded by the word Eurozone you think a forecast of 1.5% GDP growth is something to celebrate. About 2% of that growth will be provided by immigration, by the way.


#27422

A curious day yesterday. I had lunch with two, old, long standing Conservative Councillors and businessmen and two (well to do) Tory voting farmers.

I went prepared to poke them in the eyes with a stick… 1.8 M majority of voters opted for 2nd Referendum parties, Tories only won one city in the country, the Conservative Party has been taken over by spivs, crooks an Russian spies, etc.

Much to my surprise they seemed to know all that and pretty much agreed. They had all voted Tory on the basis of keeping “Marxist” Corbyn out. Their faces winced at the mention of fat boy Liar Johnson and the Prince Regent Cummings. They did not seem to have any enthusiasm for Brexit and seemed a bit shame - faced at the way their party had been parisitised. Of course these are the old kind of Tories who actually have dignity and a sense of doing good things for society as well as for themselves.

One of the Councillors did try the counter that Labour MPs had let down all the poor towns but of course the Tories are the ones who have been in Government during the past 10 horrible years. The farmers were not happy (hardly new). It was not the fear of cuts in subsidies that they were exercised about but that the new Agriculture Bill would dictate to them what crops they could plant and how to grow them. And even more concerning was that they would not be able to compete with cheap and nasty foreign imports. Plus it will be a bureaucratic nightmare even worse than before.

In sum, the above representatives of the non zealot, core Tory voters were not at all triumphant and seemed to have forebodings about the future of their country.

I almost felt sorry for them.

IMHO,

SBK


#27423

We Remainers believe in what we know, it is Brexiteers who believe in some fanciful God.

The basic facts are that the UK and other EU states would not have the customer and worker protections we enjoy now without membership. And many other benefits such as free movement which is being thrown into the trash bin by fools who are going to cut their own throats.

Problems such as homelessness and child poverty are the responsibility of the nation states. The Tory Government, with suchlike vicious thugs as Duncan - Smith, has deliberately punished the poor to pay off the debts of the 2008 American crash and at the same time reducing taxes on the rich.

The mugs who voted for Brexit and Liar Johnson are going to get more of the same with bells on.

IMHO,

SBK


#27424

You don’t know anything. You just love to squeal about how bad things might turn out when everyone knows that economic forecasts aren’t worth the paper they are written on (as the Treasury’s laughable prediction of a -2.0% GDP recession post a leave referendum result proved so completely).


#27425

SBK,

Some valid points. I don’t disagree. Hence you won’t quote me ever claiming Brexit will make things better for the majority, or that I ever supported it. My recent observations include many lower-paid Brexiteers various perceptions. Why some voted as they did, beyond the usual accusations. Also noting that the chances are many will stay disappointed, as they’ve been for at least the past decade.

I’ve spoken about trying to make the best of something that’s now beyond recall, as opposed to my stance prior to 13/12 when I still believed & hoped that a 2nd Vote was realisable. My recent comments reflect my shift as determined by new realities.

Just as my previous comments were a sincere representation of my real-life interactions. Before 13/12, I spoke to people I know about why Brexit seemed an error based on misinformation. Why it seemed fundamentally important in the interests of democracy that we should have a 2nd Vote due to many citizens being better informed. So that any majority could be sure they still wanted to leave or decide to reject Brexit & remain.

That’s all gone. In accordance with my general philosophy in life, I’m now less focused on previously highlighted negatives, but keeping more of an open-mind until at least we get into the trade talks. I think things may (?) end up neither as good as some believe or nearly as bad as some fear.

I differ from you significantly in that I also hope the UK makes the best job possible from Brexit, not least as it’s the home of my family & my friends. To that end, I take a more balanced view of a still evolving situation. - GL.

Typos corrected. Typically distracted by trading screens when commenting.


#27426

More (hundreds) of redundancies at Jaguar Land Rover, Halewood, Merseyside have been announced…

Des Quinn, Unite:
"
The challenges being faced at JLR are also being experienced by other UK car factories.
The UK’s car industry has plummeted from being the jewel in the crown of the UK’s manufacturing sector in a few short years, directly as a result of Government inaction.

Until the Government ensures that there is long-term frictionless trade and no tariffs with the European Union, along with meaningful investment in the infrastructure to ensure the success of electric vehicles, the UK’s car industry will continue to experience severe challenges.
"


#27427

Yep Huw.
Economists, Financal Analysts, CEOs, Managers of Businesses around the UK… they all know nothing of course.

Maybe we should just listen to you instead.


#27428

A lot more than that to me, as I want more Euros for my pound and the latter plummeted due to the stupid Referendum + the slashing of the bank interest savings rates to shore up the rickety economy. And the theft of my freedom of movement rights to boot.

The UK’s economic performance/productivity has been sluggish for donkey’s years and only Carney kept it on life support as opposed to Brexit supporter dotard Pervyn King who was asleep at the wheel before the 2008 crash.

IMHO,

SBK


#27429

Alternatively, we could just look at the FACTS


#27430

What a laugh, showing a Land Rover in that story which is old news about low paid pre - Christmas temporary job hiring for warehouse packers and pub and restaurant staff.

The article does point out the slowest growth fact in 7 years though.

Anyway, Land Rover’s 10% staff cut:

IMHO,

SBK


#27431

normal work 40hr a week = 1 job
zero hours 40hrs week = 40 jobs


#27432

Great deal with USA as long as … … we Beg

The US has threatened to hike taxes on car companies if Boris Johnson presses ahead with plans for a levy on tech giants such as Google and Facebook.
In an escalation of tensions, Steven Mnuchin, Donald Trump’s treasury secretary, said the US considered the UK’s proposed digital services tax to be “discriminatory” and warned that Washington could impose retaliatory taxes on the automobile industry.
But chancellor Sajid Javid said the 2 per cent levy would be introduced in April as a temporary measure until an international agreement is in place on how to deal with online giants.


#27433

What a laugh it is! Some chance of “a great deal” (sic) as the trans Atlantic brothers are falling out even before negotiations begin.

Anybody remember her: The Rt Hon Elizabeth Truss MP Elizabeth Truss was appointed Secretary of State for International Trade and President of the Board of Trade on 24 July 2019?

No of course not. Another flat on her face waste of space. Remember Liam Fox? Another abject failure. And so it goes on.

IMHO,

SBK


#27434

Yeah, but the now solidly racist HOC will overturn it again. This is a canary in the coalmine issue which shows how brutal Brexiteers are. A reminder that one should never be sucked in by this Brexit scam just to fulfil some needy urge to belong in the herd.

IMHO,

SBK


#27435

I’d really love to see this - a trade war now between the US and the UK right now. I’ve been in one with them ever since Trump got elected.

Alas, we can expect Javid and Liar Johnson to bend over the table and allow themselves to be shafted. That is the summation of the entire future that awaits Britain.

IMHO,

SBK