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Brexit Wars 3

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lse:lloy
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#12310

PTN, I believe that OldEyes is suggesting that just cancelling Brexit won’t cut the mustard for a lot of people in this country…we have to address the reasons why people are willing to risk a hard ‘No deal’ Brexit. There has to be a rebalance in the UK to counter social & economic injustice…something that nobody in power seems to be suggesting (apart from Labour maybe!!)

Part of the problem is that there is a paradox here. When TM suggested a ‘dementia tax’ to tackle social care (and ‘possibly’ reduce the tax burden for future generations) her core elderly voters (possibly pro-Brexit) weren’t happy and reduced her control on Parliament…making Brexit even harder.

To me it looks like people want change but don’t realise what sort of change is required and certainly don’t want to pay for it…Brexit means my neighbour will pay more but not me!!


#12311

O_O - good morning,
Not sure what FBPE mean but assume it is meant to describe Remainers.
Can I suggest: facetious, bullsh*ting, politicised elite.
Other suggestions welcomed!
JAR


#12312

I’m struggling too…also assumed it must be about the Remain lobby.

Although ‘perhaps’ ‘Farage Brexit Party Elite’ :thinking:…which I suppose is the same as ‘facetious, bullsh*ting, politicised elite’. :face_with_monocle:


#12313

Oilovlam & John,

Origins & purpose of FBPE. - Cheers.


#12314

I suddenly feel a lot older and out of touch with all this ‘interWeb’ stuff.

SO FBPE means ‘Follow Back Pro EU’…which makes absolutely no sense at all.

Anyway, shouldn’t it be FBPEU…the ‘European Union’ has been shortened to ‘European’ somehow.

I suppose UKIP will be condensed to UIP now…shortly before they disappear all together.

UKIP ‘lost’ 4 Welsh AM’s to the ‘Farage party’ yesterday.

image

There’s something ‘wrong’ with this picture…lady in black is standing in the wrong place!! :wink:


#12315

Then what? What are the Brexit party’s policies on mental health, railway infrastructure, elderly care, business rates, air quality, research and development, autonomous drones, the planning process, strategic industries, tertiary education.

Just 10 easy ones to get you started as you want to answer the questions Marr didn’t ask. I’m all ears.


#12316

You’ve just summed up my point. Straightaway.

Yes you’ve acknowledged the cheating and lies, we all know that, but very little recognition about where Remain went wrong and why people voted Leave.

It’s like the football fan who moans when his side loses in a narrow defeat - dodgy ref, dubious penalty etc blaming everything without ever looking to see what his side could have done better.

This week for example, moaning and moaning about Farage (not exclusive to you BTW, remainers in general), discrediting him at every opportunity instead of focusing on what Remain could do to challenge.


#12317

Its a cringe worthy twitter handle that a lot of Remain have - Follow Back Pro Europe.


#12318

Seems to have been adaped from Follow Friday is when, on a Friday, people show each other some Twitter love, by recommending to their followers who they recommend to follow.

Frog


#12319

But so what when they say that the EU isn’t run by anyone elected? Surely they are just wasting their time or there is the very first big lie right there?


#12320

Errrr!!!..surely that’s ‘FBPR’…or possibly ‘Follow Back Proportional Representation’ :wink:


#12321

Whoops - Follow Back Pro Europe


#12322

Is Remain’s only tactic hoping a load of the miserable old buggers shuffle off?


#12323

Pretty much.


#12324

Thanks Jack.

Had no idea also, in fact had not even heard of it.
You are aware of the reason why I am somewhat behind with the UK news.
Maybe that is a positive.

ATB

soi


#12325

Mostly agree Old Eyes, but politics is a rough old business.

Farage is an extreme right-winger and we know from history that we cannot fight his ideas by being nice to him. Andrew Marr in my view did a professional job in challenging Farage on views he has expressed in the past. Right now he wants to narrow the focus to Brexit and relegate his other ideas to the background to avoid alienating possible supporters. He can’t be allowed to do this.

I am aware that when I refer to the dog whistle politics of the Leave campaign that some of the Brexiters on this board then start to accuse me of calling them racist even though I have clearly said that not all Brexiters are xenophobic. To me it is abundently clear that those who ran the campaign and their supporters in the right wing press sought to mobilise those with racist view to their cause. This is a subject worthy of debate and one we cannot afford not to challenge when the risk to society is so great.

So can we discuss this kind of stuff? I think that we have to because if we leave it unchallenged the dog whistling will get more extreme.

I would agree that there needs to be an increasing focus on tackling the causes of Brexit which not really much to do with Europe at all and much more to do with neo-liberalism and Tory austerity which has deepened the divides between the haves and the have nots. This cannot be achieved through a second referendum or an EU election as the causes and answers are to be found in this country. Brexit is a Tory created crisis through and through and what we need to do ultimately is to sweep them from office.

Cheers,

Frog in a tree

I see that Grayling’s part-privatisation of the probation service is to be reversed. He is utterly symtomatic of the problem with this Tory administration where ideology trumps professional views. I have little doubt that his civil servants would have counselled him as to the risks but that he just steamrollered it through, just as he did with all his other disasters. No surprise that Grayling is a Brexiter! .


#12326

Yes. And it’s working.

The point about ‘Remain’ is that it’s pretty much like now… not much description needed… so all you can do is point out the inadequacies in any of the leaving EU options where each make the UK worse off and where leaving the EU without a deal is the option that makes the UK worst off.


#12327

O_O - thanks m8.
Prefer my definition though!
JAR


#12328

Not as if we really needed to confirm it but this latest debacle proves yet again what a waste of space the majority of our overlords really are.
There really is no point taking a side and arguing on behalf of any of them as they aren’t worth the breath you draw.


#12329

Spot on Paul, the main parties leadership and the way they speak and act, are the reasons why Farage is pushing ahead.
He doesn’t have to say much at all, when it comes to finances he will talk about expenses scandals, foreign aid, pigs in the trough, they are wide open, and he will hold back right to the end of the campaign to get the most effect.
Instead of ignoring his party, blanking and giving him as little publicity as possible, even when he is not on a panel, a chat show, or the news they give him exposure, because he frightens them. even the remainers on here have made him their main talking point. What was it an old Arsenal manager once said to the sports writers " Talk about Arsenal even if it’s bad"